Deadly Poison

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Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 12.06.08 16:12

I am sure that by now many of you are familiar with the concept of the Deadly Poison. Which is an act of extreme loyalty, a way of life, a decision made, by the individual Asetian (mostly Guardians) to kill themselves once their lover, or Master has died. It is also a belief, believed by the individual, that without her lover alive, there is no life for her as well. Although this is highly uncommon in this period of time, it was not so rare in the old days.

I would like to hear your opinion on this. How you feel about this. If you were to find your one True Love, would you believe that your life has no meaning without him/her, to a point that life would be meaningless to you, and death would be your only path?

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Karnath on 13.06.08 10:01

Em Hotep.

For a Guardian, the most important objective in life, maybe the only, is finding the True Love.

My main answer to that question, would be "Yes, I would believe that my life had no meaning, and I would rather objectively end my life, so I could entwine with my lover's soul again in the Duat, or in a new incarnation, as soon as we would be able to do so."

But life isn't that simple, and if you made a pact to endure for as long as you are needed in this plane, you shall not think only about your lover and soulmate. This is a question which consumes me, with which I debate myself a lot of times, and it's a problem without solution. You can't abandon your lover, but you can't also abandon your duty/pact. In my perspective, that's why some beings decide not to have a love relationship, being ultimately alone. That way, you can be emotionally stable, and still do your duty.

As I said... Guardians' main objective is to find their True Love, being with that True Love, dedicating their Blood to their True Love. Being their only duty dedicating themselves to that one love, existing in this plane loses reason. Deadly Poison.

Best regards.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Laura on 14.06.08 20:47

hmm....To die for love....It kind of rings a bell, like something I have seen in a dream or another life.
To find THE ONE, true love.... itis the greatst thing in life. To find it and then to lose it... it would break me. My heart would die in the very spot. But in life there are things sometimes bigger than us, reasons that can not let us die with that person.
If nothing else tied me to this earth at that moment... I would send my soul after my love´s in the hope of being together once more.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 15.06.08 10:38

Em Hotep Karnath.

I can agree with you, that the most important objective, and goal in life, to a Guardian, is not only finding True Love, but living and breathing only for it.

It is also true, to my understanding, that although you cannot abandon your True Love's Soul after death, you also cannot forget your duties on this plane. Yet keep in mind, that the act of the Deadly Poison is most common among the deeply loyal lineage of the Guardians, and the duty or goal of a Guardian, IS to live for the one she loves.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Syrianeh on 01.10.08 9:44

Well, I have put myself in the other side - if I was the dying half of the two (given it was not a sudden death). It would make me feel egotistical to know that my loved one would kill himself in order to follow me beyond. I would want them to live out their life because, as I see it, each life we live is an opportunity to advance and to evolve. Whatever we learn and take along with us, whatever we accomplish, will echo in the following lives. I would hate to know that I was keeping someone else from using up that opportunity and from their own advancement.

And also, if we were linked, we'd meet again sooner or later.

On the other hand ĦAh, the heroicism of it!
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 02.10.08 5:11

Syrianeh wrote:Well, I have put myself in the other side - if I was the dying half of the two (given it was not a sudden death). It would make me feel egotistical to know that my loved one would kill himself in order to follow me beyond. I would want them to live out their life because, as I see it, each life we live is an opportunity to advance and to evolve. Whatever we learn and take along with us, whatever we accomplish, will echo in the following lives. I would hate to know that I was keeping someone else from using up that opportunity and from their own advancement.

And also, if we were linked, we'd meet again sooner or later.

On the other hand ĦAh, the heroicism of it!

I can understand what you mean, and it does make a lot of sense. What would your thoughts be, putting yourself on the other side, being the one who is the one losing his/her Love, or Master?

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Syrianeh on 02.10.08 5:38

I have thought about this, too. I suppose such a pact would come after much communication and mutual understanding. In this case, if I felt that my life had no sense and I strongly believed the other was my soulmate, AND I believed it would mean travelling together beyond this life, I would have no qualms as to take my own.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Maktub on 02.10.08 11:00

Aghrab wrote:
Syrianeh wrote:Well, I have put myself in the other side - if I was the dying half of the two (given it was not a sudden death). It would make me feel egotistical to know that my loved one would kill himself in order to follow me beyond. I would want them to live out their life because, as I see it, each life we live is an opportunity to advance and to evolve. Whatever we learn and take along with us, whatever we accomplish, will echo in the following lives. I would hate to know that I was keeping someone else from using up that opportunity and from their own advancement.

And also, if we were linked, we'd meet again sooner or later.

On the other hand ĦAh, the heroicism of it!

I can understand what you mean, and it does make a lot of sense. What would your thoughts be, putting yourself on the other side, being the one who is the one losing his/her Love, or Master?

Aghrab
I really can't agree much with Syrianeh and Aghrab on this. The subject at hand is the Deadly Poison, that although being applied to any Asetian it is mostly a hallmark, in usage, of the Guardian lineage. That being said, and according to what we know in terms of Asetian Psychology when it comes to the Guardians' psyche, is that they ultimately live for their loved One alone, and nothing else. That being said, Life is only Life when it is lived with and for their love/master/creator/X. That being said, a Guardian living past their beloved's death would not only destroy her on the inside, but would keep her from living until she can reunite with him again in the Duat (afterlife). So asking from a Guardian to stay alive after that situation it is not really cherishing her love and most of all being careless about her suffering, that her and her alone can comprehend. I believe the situation of spiritual evolution does not come in place in here, since the Guardian's soul would not be even "here" and "alive" to strive for that evolution of the Self, but would be lost in the grief and energy of her love that was now out of her reach and on which she depends upon. The true egoism would be to ask for a Guardian not to take her life, if that is honestly her True Will.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 02.10.08 11:06

Maktub wrote:I really can't agree much with Syrianeh and Aghrab on this. The subject at hand is the Deadly Poison, that although being applied to any Asetian it is mostly a hallmark, in usage, of the Guardian lineage. That being said, and according to what we know in terms of Asetian Psychology when it comes to the Guardians' psyche, is that they ultimately live for their loved One alone, and nothing else. That being said, Life is only Life when it is lived with and for their love/master/creator/X. That being said, a Guardian living past their beloved's death would not only destroy her on the inside, but would keep her from living until she can reunite with him again in the Duat (afterlife). So asking from a Guardian to stay alive after that situation it is not really cherishing her love and most of all being careless about her suffering, that her and her alone can comprehend. I believe the situation of spiritual evolution does not come in place in here, since the Guardian's soul would not be even "here" and "alive" to strive for that evolution of the Self, but would be lost in the grief and energy of her love that was now out of her reach and on which she depends upon. The true egoism would be to ask for a Guardian not to take her life, if that is honestly her True Will.

Maktub

Very well said, Maktub. I guess I was mistaken on the points you made. Great post.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Syrianeh on 02.10.08 12:24

Very well put, Maktub.

However, I was expressing my own point of view, from how I think I would feel given this situation. I understand your view and can only hope to come together in this life with someone who will inspire me the desire to follow them beyond it, or to be followed by them.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 02.10.08 13:41

I completely agree with Maktub ,
Deadly Poison is not suicide , but a death from inside
My question would be , what do you think (empathically) that could still keep a Guardian alive after This loss ?
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 02.10.08 17:31

Hellen wrote:Deadly Poison is not suicide , but a death from inside

A wise person once told me "Deadly poison IS suicide, to keep the insides alive forever." and I highly agreed with him. However it is a suicide to live, to the Guardians. This is their escape from truly "dying" in life and in their hearts, with the loss of what fed their lives.

Hellen wrote:My question would be , what do you think (empathically) that could still keep a Guardian alive after This loss ?

Nothing. Think of it, if a Guardian did have a True Love, then that Love would be above All, and if he dies, then there is nothing left. Also keep in mind that we are speaking of a Guardian WITH a Love, a True Love, and not any Guardian. Also this is easier to imagine in a Elder Guardian, who are far more elite and highly evolved, at least this is how it seems to me.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 03.10.08 0:45

Hello Aghrab ,

what i was actually saying was that i don't see Deadly Poison to be something phisically done with the aid of a weapon , or real poison or other ,as in the ritual act of suicide as harakiri or sepukku in japanese tradition for example , but like a natural death , one death that comes from inside in the case of Guardians .Also the tradition for the wife to be buried together with husband i think has its origins from here ,seen as a duty , but in case of Loyal Guardians it is their Will and comes natural , is not from obligation , or from a pact of marriage.
but i think there is one thing that could keep them alive , and that would be the Love for Aset her children ,a Guardian would never leave them while in danger or at war

Thank you

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 03.10.08 1:03

And indeed Mors janua Vitae , when i said death from inside , i meant phisical death , i did not say death of the soul
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 09.10.08 19:13

Hellen wrote:but i think there is one thing that could keep them alive , and that would be the Love for Aset her children ,a Guardian would never leave them while in danger or at war


I actually believe if the Guardian, although a being of Loyalty, Commitment and Power, would not go on in a "war" if her Love passes away. She would be too dead to go on in a battle. This does not mean she is weak, but simply that the Guardian would lose everything once her Love has died, that not even the Love she has for the Eternal Family can keep her to stay.

But the again, Guardians were highly known for being in the Imperial Guard, fighting blindly, fearlessly, to death against their enemies...

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 10.10.08 3:32

Aghrab wrote:
Hellen wrote:but i think there is one thing that could keep them alive , and that would be the Love for Aset her children ,a Guardian would never leave them while in danger or at war


I actually believe if the Guardian, although a being of Loyalty, Commitment and Power, would not go on in a "war" if her Love passes away. She would be too dead to go on in a battle. This does not mean she is weak, but simply that the Guardian would lose everything once her Love has died, that not even the Love she has for the Eternal Family can keep her to stay.

But the again, Guardians were highly known for being in the Imperial Guard, fighting blindly, fearlessly, to death against their enemies...

Aghrab

I agree that when this happens to a Guardian she is too dead inside to go on with life or fight in battles.
But when this happens at war , first comes the rage , and only after comes the pain , and rage is a very powerful engine .But indeed this is not a common situation.So ...who reads this, does not have to generalize ,these are just.. my feelings.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 10.10.08 4:22

Hellen wrote:first comes the rage , and only after comes the pain

I still believe the pain over the loss of her Love would be far deeper, and far more intense than the rage she would feel in a "battle", and above all, I believe nothing could keep a Loyal Guardian to remain without her reason of existence - her Love.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 10.10.08 4:49

Aghrab wrote:
Hellen wrote:first comes the rage , and only after comes the pain

I still believe the pain over the loss of her Love would be far deeper, and far more intense than the rage she would feel in a "battle", and above all, I believe nothing could keep a Loyal Guardian to remain without her reason of existence - her Love.

Aghrab

i still think that is a difference between rage versus love in general , and rage when love has to be revenged , Aset herself did that .
I think a Guardians rage should be esteemed as the most fearful thing ,
one should never consider that killing a Guardian's One is actually as killing 'two in one' if they ever dare.
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Cannot grasp the emotion

Post by Maxx on 10.10.08 11:25

Dear Aghrab,

I have been watching this post from the beginning trying to find out what I have been missing in life as I seem to not be able to understand the whole concept of killing ones self over the loss of a loved one/mate. I simply cannot understand it. It is not within me. Why I am confused is that in looking at the Asetian Bibble and the personality of each type, I found I fit almost every trait of a Guardian. I must be totally mistaken in that respect. Maybe I am more in line with the Sethians, then, as I cannot find within me the reason for killing myself if my mate was gone to the other side.

My thoughts are that the Vampire lives for life first and foremost. I will survive to the last breathe without giving up. I will fight to the death and not give up no matter what the odds and no matter who the adversary is. I simply cannot understand what emotion you are talking about in the above post description. If there is some part I am missing, please spotlight it for me. I suppose i am very warped in life. I cannot even punish or kill an animal of any type, but I have no problem in eliminating a human and would not think twice. Example. Driving the highway three days ago, I was in open praire land. I looked and saw a skunk walking across the highway. I had to do some manuvering but got off the highway to miss the animal and give it a wide berth. But in the oncoming lane I saw a truck approach and as it passed me swerved into the lane that the skunk was trying to get off the highway, and the truck purposely ran over and killed the animal as I watched in the rear view mirror. This upset me very much and I still think about it. I spoke and created a very bad happening to the truck driver and let it go with him to inflict him in the next 30 days............to slowly accomplish this destruction. To see that animal killed like that created a horrible emotional trauma which I still have and see. But I transferred that emotion into the destruction of that individual that killed the animal which I found very easy. Again, maybe I am a very warped individual but that shows my feelings in this area.

Regards,

Maxx
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Victor on 10.10.08 13:05

Maxx wrote:Dear Aghrab,

I have been watching this post from the beginning trying to find out what I have been missing in life as I seem to not be able to understand the whole concept of killing ones self over the loss of a loved one/mate. I simply cannot understand it. It is not within me. Why I am confused is that in looking at the Asetian Bibble and the personality of each type, I found I fit almost every trait of a Guardian. I must be totally mistaken in that respect. Maybe I am more in line with the Sethians, then, as I cannot find within me the reason for killing myself if my mate was gone to the other side.
The answer to that may be because you have no Love in life. The Guardian's attitude that Aghrab described applies only to Guardians that have a soul mate, which are not every Guardian, but only a rare few. In the case of a Guardian without another "half" of his soul, then in that situation I believe the Guardian would fight for life, honor and his mission until his last breath. Mostly, I can see a Guardian to do everything, but really everything, for their family (the Aset Ka), truly faithfully living for them.


Maxx wrote:
My thoughts are that the Vampire lives for life first and foremost. I will survive to the last breathe without giving up. I will fight to the death and not give up no matter what the odds and no matter who the adversary is. I simply cannot understand what emotion you are talking about in the above post description.
Life is not the utmost reason and engine for a Vampire. Love is.
Certainly, as rare as it is, most Vampires do not Love. And then is where fully applies what you just described... Life as an unconditional right and reason of existence.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Aghrab on 10.10.08 13:15

Maxx, Victor basically said what I was going to say.

However what I mentioned in my previous post about the nature of the Guardian and how nothing can keep them from staying if their Love passes away, applies pretty much to Elder Guardians, or ones WITH a Love in their life.

As I said, Guardians were known for fighting fearlessly in the feared Imperial Guard... so I did not say that this makes them weak, not to "fight to death", however losing their Love, DOES kill them at heart unless the Guardian follows.

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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Hellen on 10.10.08 14:08

Hi Maxx ,

despite of having this seemingly contradictory discussion with Aghrab we were in fact talking about a particular situation in the last posts .
For the essence I share the same vision as she does .
You have to know Love to understand how Love is entwined with Life and Death .


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Just a too simple life.

Post by Maxx on 10.10.08 15:23

From my statement......I simply cannot understand what emotion you are talking about in the above post description......then all of you have shown me that I live life without a soul mate. I walk alone. No real love. BUT.....here is the strange part, I am uncanny in my happiness. In fact some think I am taking drugs....cod liver oil and fish oil caps....and I am happy in life as it seems I am complete. I even take 5-HTP caps. I also do not understand what people are talking about when I hear people talk of being depressed or living with anxiety. Depression does not live at my house. LOL.

Anyway, thank you for showing me what I have come up short in life with. I just simply could not associate with what you guys/gals were talking about.

Regards,

Maxx
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Syrianeh on 11.10.08 7:14

Maxx wrote: To see that animal killed like that created a horrible emotional trauma which I still have and see. But I transferred that emotion into the destruction of that individual that killed the animal which I found very easy. Again, maybe I am a very warped individual but that shows my feelings in this area.

Regards,

Maxx

I don't think you are warped at all, Maxx. I myself belief one of the most despicable traits of humankind is its total disrespect for animals. I respect and love animals much more than I do people, because I know animals to act mainly out of instinct and self-preservation, and in many cases the preservation of their kind or even of their human protector. There is also the aspect of innocence. It truly enrages me to see how someone can take advantage of another being's innocence and vulnerability. That extends not just to animals but also to old people or children. In any case, if I see a child or elderly person mistreating a pet, I will give them a hard time for it. Whenever I think of how my beloved cat greatly depends on my protection and care it would NEVER ever cross my mind to abuse her or her trust.

Coming from a land of bullfights and pet-abusers, you can imagine how I am often extremely sad.
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Re: Deadly Poison

Post by Talibah on 08.01.09 2:49

I may be completely off the mark here, especially since there is no mention of it thus far, and if so, then please do correct me, but could someone clarify a little more about the DPVO (Deadly Poison Vampiric Order) - 'Ordo Veneni Mortiferi' ?
I believe them to be an integral part of the AK and controlled by it exclusively, but some more information would be appreciated.
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