Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

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Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 21.08.10 11:06

Has anyone read the book? The book is a compilation of data from the vampire survey that was being passed around a few years ago by Merticus of the Atlanta Vampire Alliance.

I just received the book, so I haven't had a chance to read it. I did see two references to the Aset-Ka. Laycock didn't portray the Aset-Ka in a favorable light; he asked the opinion of the infamous vampire god, Father Sebastian Todd, who was denigrating toward the Aset-Ka, claiming the AK plagiarized the ToV bible and that odd woman, Belanger.

It may be a waste of all our time to read the book. I am curious what Laycock has to say about the ToV, Temple of Set, and vampire spirituality.

Does anyone want to discuss the book? If you don't have it, I could still go through it chapter-by-chapter. Or maybe we'd be better of discussing the Asetian Bible! Then, knowledge is knowledge.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 21.08.10 11:51

Knowledge is good ether way, even if I don't agree whit the writings Smile

But no, I haven't read it, but it would be interesting to read a little about it Smile

Sincerely Divine 277
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 21.08.10 12:34

Hi Divine 277,

Thanks for the interest. I think I should clear the idea with the administration here first. If ok, I will proceed.

Kelly
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 21.08.10 14:20

Smile
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Jonathan on 21.08.10 16:20

Personally, I lost much respect towards the work of Laycock after I read how this book came out, totally biased and filled with nonsense. It is a terrible representation of the community and vampirism. Not to mention that a book that is expected to portrait the hidden vampire community is totally ridiculous that has pages with information on people like Todd, and all the other roleplayers from the online community, that have nothing to do with real vampirism. Come on, that guy even went to a show on TV saying he was tired of the whole vampire idea and was thinking of changing into something else. lol Lets get real... using people like that takes the whole credibility from something that was supposed to be a scholarly work.
In what comes to the Aset Ka, it is rather obvious that Todd would try to badmouth it, he kept trying to contact them over and over to invite them to his "vampire parties", which of course he got his invitations denied and ignored over and over. This was public at the time and properly exposed as well. Well, Asetians are no celebrities to go pose in his parties just to boost the number of his attendees. Wink He even wanted to include Asetian stuff in his damn flyers and posters for crying out loud! lol
As far as plagiarizing the ToV, I can only assume he probably did not finish elementary school, so he doesn't know how to read. Everyone is invited to get both books, read them, and then try to find any similarities. In the ToV system there are some Undead Gods that vampires have to drain life force from to sustain themselves, it is a whole silly cult with no depth or knowledge over metaphysics. It has nothing to do with what is presented in the Asetian Bible not just in terms of metaphysics but of actual spirituality. Like I and others said many times, no matter how all those roleplayers hate the power behind the Aset Ka and the respect they actually take from the real occult underground, fact is they were the first to present a public book that discusses and explores the predatory spirituality of the vampire. First and only!

It's a pity that Laycock went down the commercial road though, it could have been a nice work if it would actually have anything scholarly about it except the format.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 21.08.10 17:59

Thank you for the reply, Jonathan. I haven't really delved into the book much - just wanted to see what they had to say about Aset-Ka and I'm interested in the take on vampire spirituality.

You know, it might be good to go through the book anyway, to determine truth from fiction. What do you think about that? Members here could clear up confusion and refute bull. I know I would learn a lot.

Elendor kindly approved my request for discussion.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 30.08.10 9:37

Redhead wrote:Thank you for the reply, Jonathan. I haven't really delved into the book much - just wanted to see what they had to say about Aset-Ka and I'm interested in the take on vampire spirituality.

You know, it might be good to go through the book anyway, to determine truth from fiction. What do you think about that? Members here could clear up confusion and refute bull. I know I would learn a lot.

Elendor kindly approved my request for discussion.

maybe you should send here a pm Smile

sincerely Divine 277
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 01.09.10 14:18

Let's begin by taking a quick look at the author, Joseph Laycock. Laycock possesses a Master of Theological Studies from Harvard Divinity School and is currently pursuing a Ph.D. at Boston University.

While teaching history to at-risk high school students in Atlanta, GA, Laycock met the real vampire community. The community was gracious enough to let him enter their world. He wound up writing a journal article, another conference paper, and finally a book.

Laycock is not a vampire but has enjoyed the leap of faith the Atlanta vampires have granted him.

Mr. Laycock's Amazon homepage:

http://www.amazon.co...hr_dp_pel_pop_1

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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 01.09.10 14:20

What are vampires? Why do people follow the ways of vampirism? What are the ways of vampirism? Is vampirism a religion? Is vampirism a fantasy? It vampirism possibly a medical condition?

Large and untold numbers of people around the world consider themselves vampires. Some are even reluctant about their condition. Many consider themselves biologically distinct from other humans. The real vampire has the need to consume blood or psychic energy for their well-being which contrasts with the vampire lifestyler.

We will hear from members of the Atlanta Vampire Alliance, the Order of the Vampire, the Ordo Strigoii Vii, and even the Temple of the Vampire.

If you aren't aware of the caste systems in some vampire Houses, haven't heard about the vampyre balls, or vampire grmioires, you will find the book fascinating.

I thank Merticus of the Atlanta Vampire Alliance and the others for working so hard in creating the Vampire Survey and contacting every vampire who could be found and asking him/her to fill out the survey. I can't imagine the work that went into all of that. It must have been hairy and painstaking.

We owe Merticus, et al., a lot of gratitude.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 01.09.10 14:21

Quick Note - Feel free to discuss any section of the book that has been covered no matter where we are in the book, but please reference the chapter (and post number if applicable).


Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism is comprised of:

Preface
Acknowledgments
Chapter 1: What Is a Vampire? or, The Varieties of Vampire Experience
Chapter 2: Why Vampires?
Chapter 3: The Vampire Milieu
Chapter 4: Initiatory Vampire Groups: Vampirism as Apotheosis
Chapter 5: The Vampire Community
Chapter 6: Vampirism and Religion, a Dialogue
Chapter 7: Out of the Shadows
Chapter 8: Vampires and the Modern
Notes (20 pages)
Bibliography (16 pages)
Index

Apotheosis means exalted in a grand or divine manner, sometimes godlike but not necessarily.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 01.09.10 14:22

Preface

Despite the media attention to vampires, the vampire community remains poorly understood.

What exactly is a "real vampire?" According to Laycock, a real vampire is first and foremost a self-designated label. Monsters receive the vampire label from others; real vampires adopt it as an identity.

There is no universal definition of a real vampire. Some drink blood to sustain their health; some do not. Some are sensitive to sunlight; some enjoy the beach. Some feel vampirism is a medical condition. For some, vampirism is a religious or spiritual path.

Psychoanalyses sometimes ignores the vampire community and looks at vampires on a case-by-case basis. Yet another approach has been to consider the entire vampire community as sinister. Dawn Perlmutter, director of the Institution for the Research of Organized and Ritual Violence, contends that the vampire community is a network of cults that uses the Internet to recruit lonely and alienated kids. Laycock purports that both frameworks are inadequate, the former ignoring the cultural phenomenon in the production of identity and the latter ignoring individual vampirism.

To understand modern vampirism, one has to consider the experience of the individual vampire and the context of the larger community.

Vampires arrive at their identities through two entities: the sum total of ideas about vampirism, real and fictional (the vampire "mileau") and the vampire community who informs how the elements/ideas are interpreted.

Formal vampire groups and vampire religions are only a small portion of the community. But networking is very important for individual vampires or groups to communicate ideas.

For over a year, Laycock gathered ethnographic data with the Atlanta Vampire Alliance vampires, attending business meetings and socializing.

Vampires are not just lurking in goth clubs but they're all around us. Laycock met vampires in the fields of social work, medicine, information technology, and law enforcement. To study real vampires is to study the state of the modern world.

To sum it up in a modernistic fashion, vampirism is a search for self.
************************************************

Questions? Comments? Do you agree with Laycock? Why or why not?
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 01.09.10 14:27

Personally, I'm having trouble with semantics. Laycock states that a "real vampire" self-labels himself/herself a vampire.

What is Laycock saying? Is he saying if one thinks they are a vampire that they are? I know he is talking about identity. Maybe I'm trying to figure out what Laycock believes.

Maybe I am dense today. That certainly is a possibility. Smile
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 01.09.10 17:27

Redhead wrote:Preface

Despite the media attention to vampires, the vampire community remains poorly understood.

What exactly is a "real vampire?" According to Laycock, a real vampire is first and foremost a self-designated label. Monsters receive the vampire label from others; real vampires adopt it as an identity.

There is no universal definition of a real vampire. Some drink blood to sustain their health; some do not. Some are sensitive to sunlight; some enjoy the beach. Some feel vampirism is a medical condition. For some, vampirism is a religious or spiritual path.

Psychoanalyses sometimes ignores the vampire community and looks at vampires on a case-by-case basis. Yet another approach has been to consider the entire vampire community as sinister. Dawn Perlmutter, director of the Institution for the Research of Organized and Ritual Violence, contends that the vampire community is a network of cults that uses the Internet to recruit lonely and alienated kids. Laycock purports that both frameworks are inadequate, the former ignoring the cultural phenomenon in the production of identity and the latter ignoring individual vampirism.

To understand modern vampirism, one has to consider the experience of the individual vampire and the context of the larger community.

Vampires arrive at their identities through two entities: the sum total of ideas about vampirism, real and fictional (the vampire "mileau") and the vampire community who informs how the elements/ideas are interpreted.

Formal vampire groups and vampire religions are only a small portion of the community. But networking is very important for individual vampires or groups to communicate ideas.

For over a year, Laycock gathered ethnographic data with the Atlanta Vampire Alliance vampires, attending business meetings and socializing.

Vampires are not just lurking in goth clubs but they're all around us. Laycock met vampires in the fields of social work, medicine, information technology, and law enforcement. To study real vampires is to study the state of the modern world.

To sum it up in a modernistic fashion, vampirism is a search for self.
************************************************

Questions? Comments? Do you agree with Laycock? Why or why not?

I need more, to answer that question .... but I do see where this is leading .

Sincerely Divine 277
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 02.09.10 10:37

I can tell you this, In every Myth out there it has some kind of base in that we are created In the image of god.... Right ?

Well, we do know that humans in them self do broadcast energy, they did get a big measurement of this under the 9.11 incident.
And we do know that strong beliefs can move mountains.

So why cant we use energy to alter own deocsiri bonuklain asid ?

Sincerely Divine 277
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 02.09.10 10:45

Im sorry :S

Or own consciousness ?
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by godofbattle on 02.09.10 19:20

speaking of all this vampiyre stuff, apparently some people of the community claim that you can turn people by drinking their blood then then giving them your blood. Much like in the movies. The only way I know to turn is by the dark kiss a strictly Asetian concept.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 02.09.10 20:03

Hey godofbattle,

My understanding is that isn't not like the movies at all, but takes 4 - 6 months of agony. Not something I would want to go through!
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by godofbattle on 02.09.10 20:35

why 4-6 months pls. Give more details on this subject if you can
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Daniel09 on 02.09.10 21:12

The Dark Kiss is one of the most closely guarded secrets of the Aset Ka. No accurate information is likely to exist outside the inner circles of the Elders.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 02.09.10 22:58

godofbattle wrote:why 4-6 months pls. Give more details on this subject if you can

First, as far as I know, no Classical/Ageless/Long-Lived vampires filled out the vampire survey. I would be highly surprised if a single one did.

About the turning process, I only know it's not a spiritual change and that some people do not make it through the process.

I don't know how the process works though I have an idea. I suspect, too, or have even heard from one vampire that you end up evacuating your bowels and vomiting on a daily basis - basically like having gastrointestinal flu plus crippling pain for months on end.

It would be interesting if the Aset-Ka used that same process but I doubt it.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 02.09.10 22:59

Daniel09 wrote:The Dark Kiss is one of the most closely guarded secrets of the Aset Ka. No accurate information is likely to exist outside the inner circles of the Elders.

I wouldn't think that there would be any accurate information on the Dark Kiss either.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 03.09.10 2:12

Redhead wrote:
godofbattle wrote:why 4-6 months pls. Give more details on this subject if you can

First, as far as I know, no Classical/Ageless/Long-Lived vampires filled out the vampire survey. I would be highly surprised if a single one did.

About the turning process, I only know it's not a spiritual change and that some people do not make it through the process.

.


It wouldn't surprise me, cause if a human drinks to much blood, It causes nausea, and they do vomit .

sincerely Divine 277
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Jonathan on 03.09.10 4:51

Daniel09 wrote:The Dark Kiss is one of the most closely guarded secrets of the Aset Ka. No accurate information is likely to exist outside the inner circles of the Elders.
I agree. Even the experts and scholars who have studied the Asetians for decades have no real knowledge into those mysteries.

I also believe that the Dark Kiss practiced by the Asetians (and maybe by the Keepers and Sethians in a variation form?) is the only true way to create a vampire from a human soul.

Broken chakras new age stuff, blood drinking myths and ritual pacts with the devil are rather off from the real mysteries that hide within the core of the vampire tradition.
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Redhead on 04.09.10 1:39

It's all fascinating stuff but it's so easy to go off on a tangent. Sometimes, I think knowledge is important for the sake of knowledge. Other times, I think, "gee, I spending too much time reading BS." study
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Re: Vampires Today: The Truth About Modern Vampirism by J. Laycock

Post by Divine 277 on 04.09.10 3:32

Redhead wrote:It's all fascinating stuff but it's so easy to go off on a tangent. Sometimes, I think knowledge is important for the sake of knowledge. Other times, I think, "gee, I spending too much time reading BS." study

Lol... Whit Human history and knowledge scattered trow the winds,

We need to be careful what we conclude to be real...

So some will be BS, as you said , some is not Smile

And its up to each one, to decide if its worth it, or not ....

But do keep In mind that, the most of the writers out there, do believe that there writings are accurate, even if they may not be, I'm not saying that they are not right at some points, but not necessarily the hole thing , its like their fate or belief ( in a way ).

Sincerely Divine 277
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