Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

+19
Sabbath
AlexaAnghel
Tiet
Sarrum
Sybil Mason
Selene Skotia
VedantaBlack
Void
Sypheara
MysticLightShinethForth
Victor
Rhea Kaye
Tehom
Nightshade
PLM
Naoom
Jonathan
Maxx
James
23 posters

Page 8 of 8 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8

Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Nightshade 17.11.20 15:08

Jonathan wrote:PLM,

First what you are saying to Rhea isn’t true. The primal craft site doesn’t sell books by other authors, it sells books by Mark Alan Smith only. Primal craft is Mark and a few sheepish drones like Matthew, Jason and Raven, it’s not really an actual occult order or temple.
What Rhea posted is the latest email sent to devotees in Mark’s personal mailing list, not the site. If you think he has good linguistic skills you haven’t been paying attention, just look at Mark’s previous message shared by James a few pages prior in this thread. It looks like something written by someone in primary school. Same situation is attested by the countless private communication from Mark to devotees easily available to those seeking out such information. He often doesn't express himself very well and his books are heavily post-edited, as is the latest mailing list entry motivated by what he read in here. Being born in England doesn’t automatically make someone capable of quality coherent writing. I’m personally aware of several compatriots of mine here in the States that can’t write better than monkeys, yet English is their primary and only language. And in case someone starts cherry picking what I say and calling me a racist I’m talking about ordinary white and entitled Americans.

You’re complaining about the lack of content on Aset Ka but that can be easily fixed by creating the content you wish to see. Be the change you want to see in the world, no? It's easy to just ask for others to do the work for you but that's not the way of the world, especially not in harsh and difficult paths such as Asetianism. You have several members in this forum who have been students of the Asetian path for decades, there just isn’t the motivation to constantly create new content that caters to the needs of newcomers. They must do their own hard work, their own research and their own praxis first. If anyone has valid questions, ask away and there is usually someone willing to share a thing or two, if the doubts are earnest.

Let me also add that much of this post took off in some form of comic relief, because much about the whole situation with primal craft is quite funny and ironic. There is nothing wrong with people actually sharing a laugh and having some fun among friends. That is what this thread reflects, besides the obvious exposure of what could be considered by the more elitist an occult fraud. So just cool off, there’s no need to be so heated up due to some people having a good time. Personally I have no invested interest against primal craft or their people. In the higher present reality of the occult and witchcraft they are pretty much no-players and have no actual relevance or influence in the underground. Go through the private libraries of the many initiatory orders out there and you won’t find Mark’s books present. Ask yourself why. Inquiry about primal craft to initiates of the likes of Ordem Peninsular, OTP, traditional witchcraft covens in Europe, including Hekatean ones, or even TFC and Temple of the Black Light and they might not have even heard about it and the ones who did couldn’t care less. So there is no emotional charge here, just some shared fun and a much needed call for awareness like in the threads about Father Sebastiaan or Michelle Belanger and their exploits.
If you feel so bothered by it to the point of insulting all users here as "whinny ass posers" when you barely know anyone then you should look within and see what's causing your own emotionally charged reaction.

Finally, Vampirism Forum isn't an airport. You don’t need to announce your departure.
Take care!

Now THIS is what I call driving it home. Excellent reply Jonathan, on every level.

I just wanted to ask PLM, out of fairness, that he please doesn’t compare this forum to those on primal craft. What people are doing here they are doing it out in the open, fairly and with honor, in a public forum, not hiding in their little groups like Matthew and others are doing about us. They’re welcome to join in and show us a different side of their nature, maybe a more elegant and honest approach, but you know that just won’t happen. Actually you saw Matthew joining here under Mark's explicit instruction in a desperate attempt to save face and quickly ran away with tail between his legs when he saw that this place is immune to manipulation.

In here we talk openly and are not scared of confrontation. We don’t hide behind little echo chambers. Many reading might not be aware of this but this forum is older than every book ever published by Mark Alan Smith. It’s older than primal craft. So it’s just pathetic to see Matthew trying to diminish and insult this forum and community in his limited circles while he has no idea what he is even talking about.

If Mark actually believes that what James has exposed is false then he is welcome to join in and clear it all up, but I suspect he's not the type to do so in a place where he might face opposition and isn't just speaking to a crowd of devoted fans. From my experience this community has always been open to fair and honest communication, even towards those who oppose them. Either way, whatever he decides to do, it's just not very wise to have his students ignorantly bash and libel a community that is much older than Mark's entire endeavor into the occult. Not very wise at all...
Nightshade
Nightshade
Adept
Adept

Number of posts : 369
Location : The Mind
Registration date : 2013-06-15

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Sabbath 18.11.20 13:05

Unless one had been granted true insight by The Great One, all who take on the title of 'leader' or 'prophet' is bound to be a false shepherd. They seek to bind the minds of others, crippling their capacity to Reason, and reducing them to dumb animals.

One should never seek them out, nor should they consume whatever tainted knowledge they produce. For their knowledge is poison. A poison that cripples the mind. A poison that makes you co-dependent. And when that happens, you experience True Death. For when you give up independence, you relinquish everything. By giving up Independence, you submit to True Evil: The enslavement of your mind to anther's. To grant another authority over your mind.

To quote the Great One "A rational mind does not work under compulsion; it does not subordinate its grasp of reality to anyone's orders, directives, or controls; it does not sacrifice its knowledge, its view of the truth, to anyone's opinions, threats, wishes, plans."

To truly be alive, one must be Independent.

True greatness comes from within. It only comes through great effort, and your effort alone. For only through your only work can True Greatness be achieved.

Sabbath
Sabbath
Beginner
Beginner

Number of posts : 6
Location : Old Country
Registration date : 2020-11-17

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Samantha 09.01.21 12:16

I have only just created this account to come here and thank everyone for this thread. I hope that this is acceptable and that I’m allowed to join for this reason, if not let me know.

I purchased several Primal Craft books and have contacted Mark Alan Smith about the rites, he told me that he only helps those who purchase directly from him and pay directly to him or Miskatonic Books, which seems maybe another front for Mark and Primal Craft. So I tell Mark this is unfair because I have the original books and paid premium for them, I should not have my practices limited because he didn't get the money directly. He insists that I must pay to him although there is another secret way. I ask him about what other way he says he can help if I take full body photos of myself with the books and also share with him my home address. What the actual fuck? What does he need my home address for? Full body photos? The guy is a creep!

I wanna thank everyone here for this amazing post! I found it searching online and this post is very important for people looking into Primal Craft as it can save them a lot of trouble and money. Wish I had found this post before wasting cash on these books. Only to find out they're full of nonsense and fiction from a creep.

Stay away from it. This is not a real tradition!

Samantha
Beginner
Beginner

Number of posts : 1
Location : USA
Registration date : 2021-01-09

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Ramla-Meryt 09.01.21 13:14

Samantha wrote:I have only just created this account to come here and thank everyone for this thread. I hope that this is acceptable and that I’m allowed to join for this reason, if not let me know.

I purchased several Primal Craft books and have contacted Mark Alan Smith about the rites, he told me that he only helps those who purchase directly from him and pay directly to him or Miskatonic Books, which seems maybe another front for Mark and Primal Craft. So I tell Mark this is unfair because I have the original books and paid premium for them, I should not have my practices limited because he didn't get the money directly. He insists that I must pay to him although there is another secret way. I ask him about what other way he says he can help if I take full body photos of myself with the books and also share with him my home address. What the actual fuck? What does he need my home address for? Full body photos? The guy is a creep!

I wanna thank everyone here for this amazing post! I found it searching online and this post is very important for people looking into Primal Craft as it can save them a lot of trouble and money. Wish I had found this post before wasting cash on these books. Only to find out they're full of nonsense and fiction from a creep.

Stay away from it. This is not a real tradition!

That is abhorrent. Thank you for posting in order to raise awareness.
Ramla-Meryt
Ramla-Meryt
Insider
Insider

Number of posts : 177
Location : Between the sacred and the profane.
Registration date : 2018-03-19

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 09.01.21 13:20

Hello Samantha. Whether you decide to stay or not, welcome to the forum.
All I can say is, WOW. That is so disgusting and creepy. Thank you for sharing that so others can hopefully see and remain safe and aware.
Best wishes.
Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Fallen 01.04.21 23:21

I am also new to the forum and am grateful for the insight and information about the primal craft and its author. But I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with. First are all of Marks books bogus? Because I have known of a few people who dislike Mark but say that his books are legitimate (his least the early books that is). Also does anyone have a suggestion for other books on the darker side of the occult? Please no EA Koetting or the like lol ^_^

Fallen
Beginner
Beginner

Number of posts : 1
Location : New Mexico
Registration date : 2021-03-30

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 03.04.21 0:37

Hi, welcome to the forum.
If you're looking for some books about Hekate, I'd suggest the new one from Asenath Mason. I know you asked for no Koetting, and Ms. Mason is published through BALG, but her work has some credibility. In fact, there is a contribution from Jack Grayle in that book, and he is quite highly regarded in Hekatean witchcraft circles for his work.
The book looks incredible, honestly.
Other than that, I hear Jeff Cullen has a new book out called Liber Khthonia that seems to be getting a lot of favorable reviews.
And of course, no recommendation is complete without mentioning the works of Luis Marques.

Well, as for Mark's books, really, I'd recommend that you stay away from them. Just my view. They do not land favorably upon most people's subconscious minds. Mark's work has an uncanny tendency to amplify the ego problems of those following it, unless you're already initiated and experienced enough to pick out the many, many parts that are... lacking. Also, as said above, Mark's current is not ancient and doesn't connect to the real Hekate, only an egregore.
Hope this helps.
Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Stasya 03.04.21 14:56

Fallen wrote:I am also new to the forum and am grateful for the insight and information about the primal craft and its author. But I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with. First are all of Marks books bogus? Because I have known of a few people who dislike Mark but say that his books are legitimate (his least the early books that is). Also does anyone have a suggestion for other books on the darker side of the occult? Please no EA Koetting or the like lol ^_^

I have been lurking here and felt the need to chime in at this point. I have two things to say, one of which partially echoes what Rhea Kaye said including her book recommendations, although I don't agree with dismissing all of Mark's work. I followed Mark's work and have followed the primal current for years, and Queen of Hell by itself (detached from everything else Mark has done) is an excellent devotional work to Hecate. It is a complete grimoire that stands on its own. As for the other books, I've had direct contact with Lucifer through The Red King, and I think that book is also very good. The Scoprion God is interesting but starts to introduce some questionable things that feel out of place with the primal current, and then the sacrificial trilogy is very different and I feel where Mark lost touch with the current and Hecate (just my own feelings based on having all of the physical Primal Craft books). The early books are not bogus, but what one gets out of them, like most grimoires, will differ wildly for a large number of reasons.

With that said, unfortunately certain things about Mark have come to light, what has been shown in this thread and what I have seen elsewhere, for example what Samantha and James have talked about here, that make me question his motives, character, and the quality of his current output (beyond what I have already stated about the later books). I can't recommend purchasing his books based on that, unless Mark himself were to clear up everything, which I am doubtful will happen. In any case I hope this helps and you find what you are looking for.

Stasya
Beginner
Beginner

Number of posts : 1
Location : N/A
Registration date : 2021-01-31

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Jonathan 03.04.21 18:09

Fallen wrote:I am also new to the forum and am grateful for the insight and information about the primal craft and its author. But I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with. First are all of Marks books bogus? Because I have known of a few people who dislike Mark but say that his books are legitimate (his least the early books that is). Also does anyone have a suggestion for other books on the darker side of the occult? Please no EA Koetting or the like lol ^_^

I would avoid Mark Alan Smith’s books not because the primal currents don’t exist but because it has been very much demonstrated that Mark has been removed and banished from it. Anyone who tries to “trademark” a current, especially one of a primal nature, or pretend to be its silly mortal gatekeeper, will find themselves lost into oblivion and that may very well describe the downfall we have all observed when it comes to Mark and some of his minions. He has lost touch with reality, has been obsessing about fictitious enemies and became what many have described as an unstable personality showing signs of fanaticism, which are all trademark signs of someone who failed said initiations so common among the Qliphothic pathways.
As Rhea referenced, when it comes to Hekate I would also recommend the work of Jack Grayle for a more historical approach and Asenath Mason for a more Qliphothic take. Some have suggested that Mark has “taken” from Asenath’s earlier work and honestly that wouldn’t surprise me, although that's up for debate and interpretation. Not really that important at this point.

As a final note, and reiterating the words of someone very credible within the community, I would suggest that if you really want to work with Hekate you find much purer gateways in the Asetian current as secretly taught by the Aset Ka than through Primal Craft. Not only is Asetianism a far more ancient tradition with a more genuine following among those in the hardcore occult underground and the nameless masters of magic and the mysteries, as the truly profound gateways presented by Asetian authors such as Luis Marques are on a much higher level than anything Mark can grasp or understand.

The Asetian path IS the actual primal current of magic. This is important to underline since many don't know it or understand it. The Aset Ka is the actual gateway to primal witchcraft.

So to conclude this make sure to always go to the purer sources, the most genuine and unfiltered currents. You’ll gain far more insight, growth and liberation than through the abridged versions of the Art as brought forward by Mark Alan Smith, EA Koetting, Michelle Belanger and Michael Ford.
Jonathan
Jonathan
Master
Master

Number of posts : 2794
Location : United States
Registration date : 2008-06-05

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by MysticLightShinethForth 04.04.21 13:34

Jonathan, you mention how through Asetianism we can open up better and more reliable gateways to work with Hekate. We've had many discussions on Her in the Discord server. I don't remember all of them, but I believe we've touched upon Hekate in relation to Aset, in different ways. One of them was, I believe, through history and mythology, if they were in any way related. There seem to be certain clues spread around here and there that they indeed relate to each other. One of those examples is actually by there being, supposedly, some relation between Hekate and Anubis, and as we know, Anubis is the loyal ally and protector of Aset or Her Children by extension through His Children, the Anubians. This connection between Hekate and Anubis, then, was mentioned in a discussion relating Hekate as a potential face of Aset Herself but that, to me, is a very tricky question. However, my own question is simply this: are Hekate and Aset/Asetianism allied forces? It seems they're very compatible, to say the very least, and we have many Asetianists that are inclined and interested in working with Hekate and do work with Her so to me they appear very closely on good terms, as if being somehow allied which wouldn't surprise me. Well, the nature of your statement that you can open up better gateways to work with Hekate through Asetianism does seem to place them as allies, in theory, if one could call it that, no? But the main curiosity, perhaps, is any official statement on this by the Order itself - and many other have expressed similar wishes - but for that we can only keep our hopes. Smile
MysticLightShinethForth
MysticLightShinethForth
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1107
Location : Sweden
Registration date : 2014-02-02

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Jonathan 04.04.21 17:51

MysticLightShinethForth wrote:Jonathan, you mention how through Asetianism we can open up better and more reliable gateways to work with Hekate. We've had many discussions on Her in the Discord server. I don't remember all of them, but I believe we've touched upon Hekate in relation to Aset, in different ways. One of them was, I believe, through history and mythology, if they were in any way related. There seem to be certain clues spread around here and there that they indeed relate to each other. One of those examples is actually by there being, supposedly, some relation between Hekate and Anubis, and as we know, Anubis is the loyal ally and protector of Aset or Her Children by extension through His Children, the Anubians. This connection between Hekate and Anubis, then, was mentioned in a discussion relating Hekate as a potential face of Aset Herself but that, to me, is a very tricky question. However, my own question is simply this: are Hekate and Aset/Asetianism allied forces? It seems they're very compatible, to say the very least, and we have many Asetianists that are inclined and interested in working with Hekate and do work with Her so to me they appear very closely on good terms, as if being somehow allied which wouldn't surprise me. Well, the nature of your statement that you can open up better gateways to work with Hekate through Asetianism does seem to place them as allies, in theory, if one could call it that, no? But the main curiosity, perhaps, is any official statement on this by the Order itself - and many other have expressed similar wishes - but for that we can only keep our hopes. Smile

I would agree with this compatibility that you’re mentioning, even though we don’t have that official confirmation by the Order as you also rightfully noted. This is particularly true when it comes to the darker aspects of Hekate relating to the underworld and the forces of death, which have differences from the more palatable Hellenic approaches that you find in modern religious reconstructionism. So I can see how you would call them allied forces in some way, or better said both are spiritual streams in the eternal current that is Asetianism. In that sense the Asetian current opens up gateways to a far more raw direct contact with primal Hekate than whatever modern systems people like Mark came up with, disguising them up in Atlantis paint and fictional role-playing games clothing.

So sure one can take something from Mark's first book (the latest ones are entirely deprived of power) but why not go directly to the source at the true primal currents like that of the Aset Ka? It's like learning basic arithmetics when you could be learning rocket science...
Jonathan
Jonathan
Master
Master

Number of posts : 2794
Location : United States
Registration date : 2008-06-05

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 04.04.21 18:38

I feel that the Aset Ka surely holds many keys over the magick of Hekate and Lilith in ways other traditions do not. I didn't begin to nurture an interest in either until the energy behind the tweets of Master Marques changed around Samhain and they opened a certain current.
It seems like most of these people aren't working with Hekate at all and merely profane the magick. I am interested to see if more learning about this other Hekate takes place over the years, the Hekate that is quite separate from what every fluff deems as their "Dark Mother".
Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Nightshade 05.04.21 16:17

Rhea Kaye wrote:Hi, welcome to the forum.
If you're looking for some books about Hekate, I'd suggest the new one from Asenath Mason. I know you asked for no Koetting, and Ms. Mason is published through BALG, but her work has some credibility. In fact, there is a contribution from Jack Grayle in that book, and he is quite highly regarded in Hekatean witchcraft circles for his work.
The book looks incredible, honestly.
Other than that, I hear Jeff Cullen has a new book out called Liber Khthonia that seems to be getting a lot of favorable reviews.
And of course, no recommendation is complete without mentioning the works of Luis Marques.

Well, as for Mark's books, really, I'd recommend that you stay away from them. Just my view. They do not land favorably upon most people's subconscious minds. Mark's work has an uncanny tendency to amplify the ego problems of those following it, unless you're already initiated and experienced enough to pick out the many, many parts that are... lacking. Also, as said above, Mark's current is not ancient and doesn't connect to the real Hekate, only an egregore.
Hope this helps.

Am I the only one who feels discouraged by Jeff Cullen’s new foray into occult writing due to his ceaseless obsession with his body, vanity and posting nudes online. I think someone forgot to teach him about the issues of advanced metaphysics with an excess of muscular mass.

Anyways at least he seems down to earth and not delusional like Mr. Mark Alan Smith. Last I heard from his followers it seems that he has been going nuts about seeing danger at every corner and questioning even his own shadow. Also has been writing how everyone has been metaphysically attacking him, which I've wondered if he actually means this forum without realizing no one here would do anything to harm him. No need to be afraid. Or maybe he’s just scared of Mr. James Dunn who eventually became like a household name among those at Primal Craft and is treated as someone scarier than Belial himself.
Nightshade
Nightshade
Adept
Adept

Number of posts : 369
Location : The Mind
Registration date : 2013-06-15

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 05.04.21 18:02

Nightshade, thank you for saying this.
I've tried to remain open-minded about this guy but I took one look at him and just had this immediate distaste. His social media is an infinite, bottomless pit in which he covertly (and sometimes not so covertly) begs for attention using his body.
Not only was I left wondering at the extent to which he can perform advanced magick with his muscular bulk, but I also kept noticing his penis obsession.  The man seems deeply obsessed with male-centered art. Most of it seems like it has to feature an overly glorified male body part somewhere in order for him to feel like it is complete. This didn't sit well considering it is supposed to be a Hekatean tradition centered around the darker powers of the feminine. I suspect that if one somehow took a look at whatever tomes are located within the libraries of serious Orders and covens, Jeff's penis doodle book would not be there. But well, perhaps I'm being too harsh, but I am used to a much more legitimate tradition in Asetianism, so I cannot help but look down my nose at this in disgust.
He's a moderator at this large Hekate study group on Facebook which I've been also nurturing quite a distaste for. The leader of this group seems to think if she amasses enough authors of Hekate groups it will make the place better, meanwhile every post is something fluffy that insults the very tradition. (People offering McDonald's French fries to Hekate, people thinking every glance, gust of the wind and minor mundane occurrence imaginable is a special sign from Hekate, and so on.) Same woman collects praise from people in some weird parade to her ego, on occasion, where she claims to be a voice of Hekate, has people calling her their mother and claiming that Hekate "shines out of her eyes".
I'm left questioning even the validity of that group because among that mod team is a new author who is known for self-promotion to annoying levels with his Psychic Witch book, something with no credibility or higher gnosis. Same guy praises Belanger as someone very important and experienced. It all leaves me wondering, I guess.
I bring that up because it seems like those subtle messages from the Aset Ka lately in their tweets, in which they opened certain gateways, came at an interesting time. It seems like pathways toward working with the real Hekate are just as restrictive as those of real vampiric magick, with just as many delusional pretenders.

I think Mark Alan Smith has completely lost his mind, if there was any of it left. One of his recent newsletters sounds alarmingly fanatic and mentally unstable. He even screams about his supposed enemies sending death energy and trying in vain to bring about his downfall using attacks, and well, I'm all but certain that Mark is talking specifically about Vampirism Forum and the Asetianist community. Especially since the community has been around so long, even before he thought of publishing anything and this thread alone has more than 10,000 views. I believe their damage control attempts here and elsewhere falling flat have led them into an imbalanced desperation.
Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 16.11.21 20:57

It seems that even despite Vampirism Forum's long periods of silence and inactivity, it retains its ability to trigger and influence people in unexpected ways.

Recently this manifested in a way that honestly was brilliant to witness.
Word of our criticism (mainly myself and Nightshade) of Jeff Cullen reached his attention, and he got so triggered by it that he had to immediately turn to his fan base to beg for shreds of validation for his ego.

I found one detail to be particularly fascinating.
Despite Jeff so egotistically taking the title "Witch King" (hello, does this remind anyone else of the plastic Vampire Community scene in America with all of its fake, ridiculous titles?) his fans, in all their rabid fear of any form of criticism whatsoever, can't come up with a single defense that doesn't involve his body. In fact, it seems like half of his fans are only there to lust after his disgusting images.

After Jeff felt threatened by the criticism here and posted his veiled fishing for validation, his fans started pouring in droves complimenting one thing: his body.
Forget all the real and solid metaphysical change Asetianists can report from all over the globe, sometimes even without contact with each other, just from studying Asetianism. That kind of rapport apparently doesn't exist in these New Age authors.

The comments section is a parade of narcissism. All these fans can claim is that myself and Nightshade are both extremely jealous of Jeff's body, and it makes me feel embarrassed for them. Because yes, sure, I am jealous of muscle. These people are exposing their mundane minds and limitations in the worst possible ways. In these minds there cannot possibly be a valid reason to criticize someone who claims being a teacher yet exhibits a narcissistic need to plaster his naked body all over the internet so people will praise him. No, the only reason is that we must be sad with ourselves and jealous of his body. (Sorry guys, but no.)

This community, to them, is one of people who "don't have anything else better to do", or are hollow inside of themselves. I find that deeply fascinating and yet another instance of that famous Mirroring we so often see directed at followers of Asetianism. We are the ones who don't have meaningful lives or anything else better to do, meanwhile these people are the ones endlessly posting nudes online, being obsessed with their physical appearances, and feeling incomplete without convincing thousands of people to worship their sex appeal while offering little else to consider about themselves metaphysically.

While I do wonder if these people are capable of finding a defense that doesn't involve an embarrassingly misaligned attempt to accuse a woman of secretly wishing she looked like she were abusing steroids, I am not exactly surprised as I watch this situation play out. If you observe Jeff's social media it is little else but endless iterations him posing in front of a mirror begging for people to praise his looks. That kind of a personality exposes one thing: someone who has a void inside of themselves and who certainly doesn't possess an iota of magickal power. Despite the silly arguments his fans are now attacking this community with, there's a huge difference between being fit and caring about your body, and going to the extreme. The truth doesn't change no matter how many special snowflakes are triggered in plastic witch circles: overly developed muscle mass is really terrible for your health, a strain on your heart and especially inhibits your ability to redirect energy in focused ways.

Ask anyone involved with traditional European witchcraft in the private covens and I have a feeling they wouldn't even recommend Jeff's book that all of these New Agers are slobbering over. (Just a feeling).

These plastic personalities are getting so old and they are popping up from every direction. Endless people taking advantage of the occult market in one way or another, even if in their conscious minds they have this false idea that they present something "groundbreaking" or relevant.

People love to hate on and criticize the Asetianist community or especially the author who brought the works into the public eye, going to shattered pieces psychologically whenever they are the target of criticism, meanwhile their very own communities are edifices of self-delusion and inept practice. New Age fluff after New Age fluff desperately asking for advice on pressing concerns: my dog farted, twitched his ear, and then looked at a fly on the wall, was it Hekate? I decided to buy a different brand of toilet paper today, was it Hekate? I ate food today, was it Hekate? I saw (insert highly normal and mundane thing) today, it was a special sign from my special Dark Mother who also thinks I am Very Special. These groups breed crowds of blind followers who can't work a single bit of magick yet pretend otherwise, all in the name of being "tolerant" and "kind". I'm starting to get the feeling that it isn't only Michelle Belanger who likes to pretend at tolerance and inclusion for the sake of breeding a pool of narcissistic supply that will cast her in the role of Enlightened Master Guide, dark mother or what have you.

It's disgusting that so many rotten voices preen themselves in a pretentious spotlight offered by social media and ignorant fans, and it probably won't change any time soon, if ever. It's just interesting to watch it all unfold firsthand, because the teachings of Asetianism warn us of this very thing, and expose the psychology behind it yet actually witnessing it is a different feeling.

Last but not least, I must apologize to the administration for the heated nature of this post, but I felt that something needed to be said. I hope in the future that at least a small fraction of new people are able to cultivate an ability to stop worshipping and putting these people on pedestals merely because they published a book, because after watching this situation echo and repeat so many times, it has become apparent that all you have to do to be seen as an occult authority nowadays is publish a book, regardless of your actual level of spiritual evolution.

I just have to applaud this community for being so staunchly against these things over the many years it has existed, in turn cultivating the same in newer generations of Asetianists.



Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Jonathan 17.11.21 8:11

To be completely honest their reactions feel like blatant insecurity and disempowerment, a desperate cry for validation among blind followers and fans that clearly have no idea what they are saying, who they are judging or what they are talking about and will just mindlessly nod in agreement at everything they are told or asked to do. Unfortunately this is very common among such superficial circles of New Age and TikTok “witches.”

This sort of herd mentality and fandom psychology always took issue with the empowered and liberated stance of this forum and its several associated communities for decades. Regardless we have been here long before them and will remain long before they move on to the next trend, hopefully far away from occultism and living traditions.

Anyways this post was about exposing Primal Craft that has been verified as a fraud, so if Jeff or Auryn want some spotlight here they should open a thread of their own. Devil
Jonathan
Jonathan
Master
Master

Number of posts : 2794
Location : United States
Registration date : 2008-06-05

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 17.11.21 9:54

At this point there is indeed probably enough material on both Auryn and Cullen to compile an entire separate thread and I'd even enjoy doing that if the community prefers.
It's just really interesting to watch them, whether it's Auryn being vile by using his literal harem of boyfriends to act like an attention whore desperate for ego validation (even going so far as to pose naked in his bathtub fishing for likes) or Cullen with his dozens of fans who are only there because they want to hit on him sexually and lust after his looks. In the end they both seem to exude an inner desperation and even sadness. People who are complete in themselves don't make themselves into that kind of a spectacle. In fact the Book of Orion is a brilliant (yet again) map and guide exposing their psychological issues with brilliant foresight.
This isn't the behavior of a real teacher or occultist. We even have Laurie Bizzaro (leader of the online fluff group that pretends to worship Hekate) triggered, who herself claims being a powerful voice of Hekate and absolutely eats up false praise from the fluffs telling her she's their spiritual mother who possesses all the might of Hekate. Triggering someone like that into a swearing rant fest is more than telling. According to her own belief, criticism of Jeff and Mat's blatant narcissism is invalid because we aren't leading public rituals for thousands of people. All I can say is wow, talk about missing the point of higher occultism. What these people do is lower/popular occultism and has nothing to do with actual magick. Being praised by a large group you built using every New Age author you could get your hands on for the purpose of mere visibility and popularity doesn't make you an authority who dictates who is or isn't allowed to criticize your staff.

I must say the behavior Jeff, Auryn and all other related mods are encouraging his fans into is downright abusive. We, strangers on a forum, call attention to something and suddenly all of these people are claiming a couple of women are jealous of a guy who looks like he is juiced up on steroids. Please make it make sense. This is like the prime example of narcissism... I'm so stuck on myself that I need to show you all my naked body countless times per week and I'm so supreme that even women, who enjoy being women and are comfortable in themselves and their own gender, must surely wish they looked like that. Sorry Jeff, and all other rabid fans: the center of the universe is not the masculine, or your penis. The center of existence is not you, or your body cultivated solely to fish for praise. If you really think witchcraft revolves around your penis and physique, and how many numerous boyfriends you can round up in a collection of social media trophies (Auryn's case), your magick is pitiful, weak, and useless, and you'll never get far in the occult beyond shallow praise and book deals.
It feels like the American occultism scene thinks spiritual evolution is measured by how much money you can squeeze out of clueless people. To many Americans occultism is little more than a commercial endeavor and barring that, it is at best a quest to use ancient teachings to merely reaffirm futile inner hopes and delusions. Once again people make me embarrassed to be an American occultist.

To all the rabid fans, I say thank you for being learning tools for those who have a mind of their own and aren't enslaved to ridiculous social media trends and vanity. Your threats to sue the forum or pursue legal action, your abusive words claiming that any and all women criticizing this behavior want so badly to be a man and look like a man, and all other related weaknesses are just feasted upon as fuel.
Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Jonathan 17.11.21 16:06

Oh yes I didn't mean for you to create an article on them but more along the lines that if they want the exposure of such a major platform like this forum they should create a thread themselves. I was being ironic though, but we all know how these people thrive off gossip and self-promotion, which only happens to be the exact opposite of what occultism truly is.
Jonathan
Jonathan
Master
Master

Number of posts : 2794
Location : United States
Registration date : 2008-06-05

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 17.11.21 16:48

It seems like Jeff conveniently left out ways to identify where the discussion came from, so it feels like both of them would be way too cowardly to come here, without the cheap support of their fans. It makes me smile in a way. Very Happy


Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Nightshade 23.11.21 15:10

Well it this thread was about exposing fraudulent occultism and a specific current, known among edgelord circles as Primal Craft, but it seems that it’s triggering other fluffs as well. Who the hell even is Laurie Bizarro? Never heard of her and I’ve never seen her work mentioned or referenced in ANY occult circle and I’ve been at this for a really long time. Also why would a Jane Doe criticize our occult accomplishments when she knows precisely nothing about the magickal work that we do and have been doing for all this time? So according to her narcissism and ego can’t be criticized and discussed? Ridiculous. An image of slavery I call it.

Concerning Jeff, despite his apparent obsession with physicality and vanity over the spiritual, I would like to say that the likes of Mat Auryn are much more of a stain on the New Age side of fluffy commercial occultism than Jeff. Auryn’s entire inspiration to get into the occult, Michelle Belanger, is a notorious fraud who has been debunked for decades now and has accumulated piles and piles of complaints from people she has harmed and exploited. You won’t find Mat’s book at any occult library of an initiatory Order or coven of reference as he just produces mass market fluffery with no magick that only holds appeal to those whose understanding of witchcraft goes as far as watching The Craft. His narcissism and obsession with viral marketing is quite a reflection of a lack of power, particularly occult and magickal power.

Who cares anyways, he is pretty much irrelevant and nameless in the living circles of the Arte, as so is Bizarro who no one even heard about. That is the problem with these newbies, they have no respect for ancestry, eldership and actual occult history when it comes to blindly and ignorantly attacking a community that is centuries older than any crap they can come up with while desperately fishing for likes.

Meanwhile, here we stand, wielding the Flame.
Nightshade
Nightshade
Adept
Adept

Number of posts : 369
Location : The Mind
Registration date : 2013-06-15

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Rhea Kaye 26.11.21 11:27

That was very well said, Nightshade. I pretty much agree on all points.

I appreciate how this community isn't afraid to speak up on such things. It's easy enough to take for granted for those of us who came into all of this at a later time and during the era of social media.

It's disturbing how these things play out, whether it's Auryn, Cullen, or even Primal Craft. The human mind and psychology leads people to vehemently defend all the wrong things for all the wrong reasons, heightened in intensity by social media trends. It feels like this community is the only island in sight willing to speak the truth even if it's uncomfortable or doesn't gain the perfect amount of shiny popularity.

Rhea Kaye
Rhea Kaye
Expert
Expert

Number of posts : 1413
Location : USA
Registration date : 2013-12-18

Back to top Go down

Primal Craft personality cult and fake power - Page 8 Empty Re: Primal Craft personality cult and fake power

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 8 of 8 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum