Thursian Currents as an Asetianist Study

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Post by MysticLightShinethForth 01.10.21 13:09

Em Hotep.

It has been the project of a few us to delve into the dark Norse magickal traditions under the Asetianist kaleidoscopic lens. Here we find, most predominantly, if not the only thing that I've personally found in terms of elaborated grimoire traditions and practices, the domain of Thursian currents. The likes of those expounded by Ekortu (Vexior) and Ljóssál Loðursson.

In the Thursian currents, as they're at least modernly presented under the lead of some of these authors, it contains a rather anti-cosmic view of the world. That is to say, in a Gnostic sense, that they're against, and adversarial towards, the demiurgic power of the Aesir (simplified: gods of civilization and cosmic order) in particular but also the Vanir (simplified: gods of nature), that is to say two of the main categories of gods in the Old Norse pantheon that are said to bring about the creation or uphold parts and functions of it as well as to enforce its cosmic illusions within the human being and her mind which an internal Ragnarök(kr) calls for and seeks to undo unto spiritual acosmic liberation and the return to Ginnungagap (primordial void, the chaos that was before the creation of the worlds by the three brothers of Odin, Vili and Vé - apart from Muspelheim, world of primordial Fire, and Niflheim, world of primordial Ice, that preexisted the creations by these three brothers and from which they themselves even originated in their own genealogies, even being of half Thursian blood). Whereas the Thursar, the Old Norse primordial Giants, whom the Thursian currents venerate, are seen as the more destructive forces raised against that cosmic order of the creation even into the given final culmination of Ragnarök or Ragnarökkr (different etymological meanings based upon individual use and interpretation, where Ragnarök means something akin to the 'Fate of the Gods' and Ragnarökkr means something like 'Twilight of the Gods', which some authors emphasize differently and use accordingly).

However, the Thursar, or Thurs beings, were there before the Aesir, then, and the sources on the genesis of the Vanir seem obscure and not much is known there but we can possibly assume that they came later as well, being gods of nature when the cosmic order had come into being by the three brothers of Odin, Vili and Vé (all three Aesir and often seen as the prime demiurgic forces). The Aesir had much of their genealogy actually in the Thurs beings themselves - the primordial Giants before the birth of the gods, similar to the Titans in Greek mythology.

My questions here, to start a forum discussion, would incline themselves towards the nature of anti-cosmism but also all else related to the main subject. There's much potential here that can be developed upon.

First of, for those of you who are involved, we've discussed a bit about the nature of anti-cosmism and how that could be seen differently, even with speculations of the Thursar themselves being akin to draconian entities in other mythologies. Maybe that the Thursar aren't necessarily these "giants" in a fictional sense either, as large and tall brutes, at all, but actually very formless beings of void, chaos and, yes, adversarial magickal power as well as primordial wisdom. That might come as a necessary introduction in the etymological sense, where the later development as "giants" comes from Latin, as well as Greek mythology, together with the fictional stories of collected folklore from the devout Christian "Brothers Grimm" during the 19th century, that all melted into a hodgepodge of confused misunderstanding regarding the popular conception of the Old Norse Giants as well as other creatures in those mythologies, like the classical trolls for instance.

Also, as another note, I believe the roots of anti-cosmism in particular within the Thursian currents, while not explicitly stated as such in the Old Norse accounts apart from being, for example, interpretable as implicit within the final event of Ragnarök, come from a heavy background in anti-cosmic Satanism with authors such as Ekortu indeed, although they might have wished to separate themselves completely, in their Satanism, from Satanism, as it's too tied into Christianity with being like a shadow side of it, into the creation of a form of current devoid of any Christian elements or allusions whatsoever. At least from what I've read regarding the modern emergence of Thursatru.

This raises two questions, though: the anti-cosmism (and how it's to be interpreted and seen), as well as the spiritual legitimacy in the foundation of the Thursian current(s). Personally I believe there is certainly strong magick to the Thursian current(s), and real validity to many of their entities, beings or deities, and it's my belief that while Thursatru itself is a modern invention, more so, the beings that they work with are very old like the Norse mythology itself indicates. However I'd like to ask others, including more experienced members of this forum, on that point in particular, and open up debate for it.

And as a final but simple question: as the title of the topic itself, how do you believe it aligns with Asetianism, if it does? The crossings, and potential verges, in between...
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Post by Jonathan 01.10.21 16:09

I agree with what you said, in the sense that while traditions such as Thursatru are modern, the beings they work with are quite ancient. Also I think it’s worth to mention that Thursatru is only one of the several paths working with the Thursar, not the only tradition, and one can operate very deeply with them without identifying as Thursatru.
I say this especially because Thursatru originated from a background of gnostic Satanism and the anti-cosmic philosophies of the Temple of the Black Light, however there have been people working with the Thursar and devoting to those dark powers long before them. Still their writings are very much worth a read, particularly those by Ekortu, and he is genuine in his devotion.

As for your final question, from what I see and know about Thursian Sorcery I would say it can be very compatible with Asetianism, especially if the magician or witch has a solid foundation in Asetianism that allows them to go through the modern material on the Thursian tradition as well as the older Eddas and dissect it from the higher perspective of the Asetians, shaping it to the immortal purpose and understanding of the Asetians. That seems very possible but also hard work, make no mistake. Potentially dangerous as well, which should be underlined, since some of the beings that one may seek communion with on such a dark path are incredibly powerful and don’t go easy on initiates, such as Angrboda, Hel, Surtr, Fenrir and Jormungandr.

This is no silly Primal Craft operating with a group egregore earthed by a mortal man, these are primordial elementals of fire and ice that are not linked to creation, so extremely destructive even if also immensely wise.

There are others here with vastly more experience than me when it comes to the dark side of Norse magick and seidr, who might have valuable details to add in due time if your studies develop in that direction. This is very much an European tradition.
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Post by MysticLightShinethForth 01.10.21 16:31

Thank you for your reply, Jonathan, beautiful points and very valuable indeed! I will contemplate it a little bit. Smile

Yes, I seem to be under the impression that these are traditions that very much fall under the secretive European occult underground, with very real forces, so they deserve great respect.
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Post by Victor 02.10.21 17:58

The Ice and Fire magick (thursian sorcery, fjölkyngi, seiðr, rúna, trolldom) of the ᚦurs, or Thursar, as the Old Norse called them but that were also known by other names in different cultures, is not only compatible with Asetianism, as it can be wielded through Asetian gateways to a higher degree of gnosis and empowerment not at the reach of those that do not grasp the sacred Asetian mysteries. Some of those powers are loyal to Primordial Aset.

Tread carefully.
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Post by MysticLightShinethForth 03.10.21 12:17

I'm sure that when I say this I speak for more than myself: you've both left great commentary that helps many of our questions immensely, or how to fit it within an Asetian context and perspective and so giving it even greater purpose. Thank you to both of you, Victor and Jonathan. Smile Em Hotep.
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Post by Rhea Kaye 03.10.21 12:18

I agree. Thank you both to Victor and Jonathan for your awesome comments, they are quite helpful and also inspiring toward our studies!
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Post by Jonathan 06.10.21 4:55

Glad that it could be of help! Smile
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